by Doors4ever
02/29/2008 | 04:37 PM
Mainboards supporting two different memory types are pretty rare these days. It is evident that solutions like that may mostly be demanding only during the transitional time, when one type of memory is still pretty popular, while the other hasn’t yet managed to become a sales hit. The users are mostly pretty skeptical about combo mainboards like that, because these boards allegedly do not work well enough with either of the memory type, feature complex PCB layout, do not suit well for overclocking… However, there is hardly any convincing evidence for this negative attitude. Let’s get back in time for a second here.
The owners of systems with AMD processors have hardly felt the recent transition from DDR to DDR2 SDRAM. The company waited for DDR2 memory to become widely spread and then moved its processors to the new socket and new memory type all at once. As a result, no one really needed combo mainboards back then. With Intel processors the situation was completely different, there were quite a lot of mainboards on i915 chipset that could work with DDR or DDR2 SDRAM. However, the chipset was not very well suited for overclocking, so it was really hard to tell if these boards weren’t overclocking friendly because of the dual-memory type support or because of the chipset they were based on. Even earlier transition from SDRAM to DDR SDRAM has already sunk into oblivion. As far as we can tell they seem to have been a few successful mainboard solutions, for example, from Elitegroup, that were pretty popular. There even home-made BIOS versions written specifically for them, however, I doubt many of you remember those days. As for the transition from SIMM to DIMM, it looks like there were simply no computers in those days at all yet. :)
So, now that DDR3 SDRAM is already selling freely, but systems with DDR2 memory are still more widely spread in the market, we have a great opportunity to check out the viability of combo mainboards supporting both memory types. We already made the first step in this direction last year in our article called Gigabyte GA-P35C-DS3R Mainboard with Universal Memory Controller. Our detailed study of mainboard features, performance analysis in nominal work mode and after overclocking, even power consumption tests – everything revealed that it was impossible to give the board a 100% positive or 100% negative verdict. On the one hand, the board overclocked dual- as well as quad-core processors perfectly well, but during memory overclocking we discovered the whole bunch of problems. Moreover, it was falling behind its competitors during performance tests in overclocked mode.
Today we are going to continue our discussion of combo mainboards and their potential during CPU overclocking with DDR2 and DDR3 memory with the help of MSI P35 Platinum Combo solution.
MSI is currently offering the whole line-up of products on a popular Intel P35 Express chipset that differ from one another by their PCB design and features. Our today’s hero, MSI P35 Platinum Combo, supports DDR2 as well as DDR3 SDRAM, which you may have already guessed from the introduction. The word “Combo” in the mainboard name indicates that feature, while the word “Platinum” implies that it comes with extensive accessories bundle and advanced features. However, we have already reviewed its closest relative, MSI P35 Platinum mainboard in the article called “Experience the Roller Coaster: MSI P35 Platinum Mainboard Review”. The mainboards are not identical, since MSI P35 Platinum supports only DDR2 memory, but they are so similar that we can still consider them twin-brothers. They have similar PCB layout, BIOS Setup features and are even bundled with almost the same accessories.
All the latest MSI mainboards that we managed to get our hands on featured individual package design of the same style. This design approach is attractive and informative at the same time: we see the logos of all supported functions and technologies against the background of some monster claws reaching for the board. But the first thing that catches your eye is the manufacturer’s name and mainboard model made in large print. It differs dramatically from the packaging of some other mainboard makers, where you have to look for the special features of the product for a while, before you actually learn what you are dealing with.
The reverse side of the box ha s a mainboard photo and a brief list of its features and accessories.
MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard comes with all necessary cables: four SATA cables with metal connector clips, FDD and IDE cables with the company logo and “Innovation with Style” logo, as well as two SATA power adapters.
Besides, there is also a colorful poster with brief installation instructions, user’s manual, two CD disks wit the drivers and utilities for Windows XP and Windows Vista, rear panel I/O Shield and an additional bracket with an IEEE1394 port. We have already seen all these accessories bundled with MSI P35 Platinum mainboard, but there are still a few differences. For example, MSI P35 Platinum Combo comes bundled with M-connectors – a set of connectors like the ASUS Q-Connector Kit. It makes it much easier to connect individual front panel cables, as well as USB, IEEE1394 and audio cables to the mainboard.
There is one more difference: MSI P35 Platinum Combo comes bundled with a pair of DDR2 / DDR3 Switch Cards referred to as DDR2 / DDR2 Turbo Cards in the user’s manual.
When you use DDR2 SDRAM, you should install DDR2 / DDR3 Switch Cards into empty DDR3 slots. If the board is working with DDR3 SDRAM, Switch Cards should be turned upside down and installed into the empty DDR2 slots. They have corresponding contact layouts on both sides. There are also certain rules: with DDR3 memory the Switch cards should go into the second and fourth DDR2 slots, but if the board is working with DDR2 SDRAM, you don’t really have much choice: there are only two DDR3 slots on the PCB, where these Switch Cards can go. However, if you intend to overclock the memory beyond DDR3-1333MHz, the Switch cards should be removed.
Pretty confusing at first, I should say. Other mainboards supporting two different memory types, do not require any type of cards or terminators at all. The good thing about these DDR2 / DDR3 Switch Cards is that they make the system look pretty. They are decorated with the LED message reading “MSI DDR II” on one side and “MSI DDR III” on another and depending on the type of memory you use, one or the other message will light up.
Even a quick glance at MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard will reveal significant similarities between this solution and the non-Combo model. This mainboard inherited a lot of features from its counterpart, including both: advantages and drawbacks. The advantages are definitely more numerous that a few layout issues we will point out later on.
MSI P35 Platinum Combo uses the same remarkable unusually looking “Circu-Pipe” chipset cooling system. Some of you may see it as a sophisticated water-pipe system, the other associate it with the rollercoaster model, but the MSI engineers claim that “the new Circu-Pipe provides the best cooling solution with its fin-typed heatsink around the heat-pipe”.
However, there are still a few differences that we should point out here. For example, the heatsink on top of Intel ICH9R South Bridge chipset has now become a little lower compared with the one used on MSI P35 Platinum non-Combo model.
This is the only noticeable difference, other than that Circu-Pipe cooling system looks exactly the same. The heatpipe originating from the chipset South Bridge heatsink base goes through the North Bridge heatsink base, rises and ends above it in a half-loop.
The second heatpipe starts with the same half-loop above the North Bridge heatsink, goes through its base and leads to the heatsink on top of MOSFET transistors.
There are two more heatpipes originating from this heatsink. One connects it to the chipset North Bridge heatsink, while the other goes through it and ends in a heatsink right next to the memory slots.
This way Circu-Pipe cooling system consists of four heatsinks with four heatpipes distributing the heat among them. The disadvantages of this approach are evident: you will inevitably have hard times installing large processor coolers onto a CPU socket framed at three sides with three other heatsinks. There are some cooler models that are completely incompatible with Circu-Pipe cooling system. However, we have already dealt with mainboards where there are four heatsinks around the processor socket, and they are still very popular among computer users. However, efficient heat distribution pattern and large heat dissipating surface of the Circu-Pipe cooling system will let you do without any additional fans, which we saw during our MSI P35 Platinum non-Combo mainboard tests.
However, this statement needs to be double-checked. We performed some tests with a dual-core Intel Core 2 Duo E6300 processor before, it was overclocked to 3.43GHz, however, quad-core processors create much higher workload. For our final evaluation of Circu-Pipe cooling system efficiency we needed to perform additional tests with a quad-core processor. We overclocked a pretty hot Intel Core 2 Extreme QX6700 processor on Kentsfield B3 core revision to 3.4GHz and kept it running under full load with Prime95 utility.
MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard cannot monitor chipset temperature that is why we had to rely on our subjective estimates. As a result of this experiment, the heatsinks and heatpipes warmed up quite a bit, but that was about it. It is dramatically differ from what we aw on other mainboards, where heatsinks were so hot, we could barely touch them. in other words, Circu-Pipe system is a really efficient cooling solution. No wonder, MSI Company continued using it for all flagship products based on Intel X38 and X48 chipsets. The only thing you should keep in mind at all times, though, is the limited compatibility of Circu-Pipe system with large processor coolers. However, on the other hand, you will hardly ever have to figure out optimal ways of fastening an additional fan to any of the heatsinks or reducing its rotation speed.
Actually, there is nothing else we could add about the features of the upper part of the mainboard PCB. We could probably draw your attention to the fact that the four-phase voltage regulator of the MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard uses the same solid-state capacitors as the rest of the board. The power connectors are located pretty conveniently, although we had to use an extender to get to the 8-pin ATX12V connector.
The lower part of the mainboard PCB gives us a lot more things to talk about:
MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard features the following expansion slots: two PCI Express x16 (with CrossFire support), two PCI Express x1 and two PCI slots. Only the first PCI Express x16 slot works at full x16 speed. The second (yellow) one shares the bandwidth with two PCI Express x1 slots. If there is a card installed into at least one PCI Express x1 slot, it changes to PCI Express x2 mode; if there are no other cards in the system, it works as PCI Express x4. The modes are switched automatically, but you can also set them manually in the mainboard BIOS.
The mainboard ports and connectors are all color-coded for your convenience. Another pleasing fact is that the traditional Clear CMOS jumper has been replaced with a convenient button. The only thing we can probably complain about is a not very conveniently located FDD connector, but since floppy disks become more obsolete this drawback loses its acuteness.
MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard feature an eight-channel Realtek ALC888 audio-controller, Realtek RTL8111B gigabit network controller, VIA VT6308P chip that provides IEEE1394 support and Marvell 88SE6111 controller that allows connecting two Parallel ATA and one Serial ATA devices. If you have a lot of SATA hard drives, you may be a little upset that there are only four SATA ports laid out on the board, although the Intel ICH9R South Bridge supports 6, however, they didn’t disappear anywhere, but are laid out on the mainboard rear panel as eSATA.
Besides two PS/2 ports for keyboard and mouse, there is also a set of four USB ports, an optical SPDIF and IEEE1394 (a bracket with additional IEEE1394 port is bundled with the board). Then there is another set of two USB ports, a network RJ45 connector, a pair of eSATA we have already mentioned above and six audio-jacks.
Now we should only point out that MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard features five three-pin fan connectors. The sixth one is a four-pin connector for the processor cooler. The mainboard is also loaded with a lot of LEDs of all kinds:
The LEDs marked as LED1 through LED6 located near the memory slots indicate if the slot is working. LED17-LED22 will light up the same way if the corresponding expansion cards are installed. LED15 indicates if the mainboard receives control power, and LED16 shows when the mainboard is powered on and running. The remaining eight LEDs (LED7-LED14) serve for diagnostic purposes and replace the POST-indicator. They are split in four groups, 2 in each, where one LED is a red one and another is a green one. The color combinations that are explained in the user’s manual allow you to determine when the booting stopped at POST stage.
All these LEDs together with the glowing words on the DDR2 / DDR3 Switch Cards create a very fun picture that you can see through a transparent side panel of your system case:
However, some of you may find these LEDs annoyingly bright and there is no way to manually disable them.
The list of technical specifications from the mainboard user’s manual sums up all the features and peculiarities of this solution:
The BIOS of MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard is based on AMI code.
It not only looks the same as the BIOS of the previously reviewed MSI P35 Platinum, but also offers practically the same functionality. Except for the support of two memory types and a new section, which we haven’t seen before, called User Settings.
It turned out that this section offers the so long-awaited option to save BIOS settings profiles. There is not much you can do here, you can only save and later load two settings profiles. If the “Load Settings” is bright, it means that the profile has been saved and can be loaded. Unfortunately, you can only guess what kind of profile that is, because there is no way of adding a description or at least a short title to it. However, it is a good start already, hopefully it will become even better in newer mainboard revisions.
H/W Monitor section remained exactly the same with the minimum acceptable set of available options.
We can adjust rotation speed only for two fans out of six that can be connected to MSI P35 Platinum Combo. For the processor fan you can set the desired CPU temperature in the interval between 40ºC and 70ºC with 5ºC increment and the minimal fan rotation speed from 0% to 87.5% with 12.5% increment. In our case the fan connector was a three-pin one, so the rotation speed management function didn’t work. You can set the rotation speed for one of the system fans at a fixed rate of 50, 75 or 100%. Moreover, the mainboard can also control two temperatures, main voltages from the power supply unit and processor Vcore.
Cell Menu section is dramatically different from H/W Monitor in terms of available functionality. Almost all overclocking friendly parameters dealing with the CPU, memory and voltage management are gathered here.
The interface is very convenient, and the parameters are grouped depending on their application. Each group related to the CPU, memory, bus frequencies or voltages is separated from the other ones with a horizontal line. There are also a number of informational parameters that report the current processor and memory frequencies as well as the frequencies that we will get after the changes apply. If the voltages are set dangerously high, they will be highlighted with warning red color. Although there are a lot of parameters here, they all fit into a single screen, only timings settings are placed into a separate window.
Although we have been very pleased with all these features and functionality so far, it doesn’t mean that there is not a single drawback we could point out (as always :) ). For example, there is no Auto setting for each memory timing individually. You can either set them all to Auto, or set them all manually. We would also like to say a few words about the available dividers used to set the memory frequency. Although the list for DDR2 memory is formally quite long and includes 1:1.25, 1:1.5, 1:1.67, 1:2, 1:1, 1:1.2 or 1:1.6, ASUS and DFI mainboards still boast more flexibility here. As for DDR3, it is even shorter: 1:1.5, 1:1.2, 1:1.6 and 1:2. The voltages cannot be set below the nominal values.
Speaking of the available voltage adjustment options, the intervals are usually quite wide, even extremely wide, I would say, and the increments are very small:
As a result, we can conclude that despite a few drawbacks we have pointed out, MSI P35 Platinum Combo allows managing all the CPU and memory parameters, bus frequencies and voltages that are theoretically required for successful overclocking. Now it is time for us to check them out in real tests.
Our open testbed used for overclocking experiments was built with the following components:
First we ran the tests with DDR3 SDRAM: 2x1024MB OCZ PC3-14400 Platinum Series (OCZ3P18002GK). With the voltage increased to 1.95V, these modules could work at 1800MHz frequency. We know very well what Intel Core 2 Duo E6300 processor (1.86GHz, 266MGz FSB, 2MB, Conroe-2M, rev. B2) is capable of: with the Vcore increased to 1.45V it can overclock to 490MHz FSB. However, the combination of 490MHz FSB and 1568MHz memory frequency didn’t work: the mainboard wouldn’t even start. When we dropped the memory frequency to 1470MHz, things didn’t get too much better: the board would start but would then hang on boot-up.
We managed to boot Windows with the 470/1410MHz combination of FSB and memory frequency respectively. In this case, the board set memory timings to 7-6-6-15 in Auto mode, however, the Performance Level was different for both channels: 7 for one and 8 for another. We assumed the system didn’t work because the memory timings were too low, so we set them to 8-8-8-24 in the BIOS, however, it didn’t help. The maximum memory divider that allowed setting the frequency a little over 1500MHz turned out non-operational. The board didn’t even start with this divider. 490MHz FSB also remained unattainable for us, and the best we could get the system to boot at was 480/1440MHz.
I have to admit that it is pretty weak result for both: the CPU and the memory. However, when we replaced DDR3 modules with DDR2, everything got clear. We installed 2x1024MB Corsair Dominator TWIN2X2048-9136C5D and the system booted in no time, loaded Windows OS and then passed the stability test at 490/980MHz FSB/memory frequencies.
Unfortunately for overclocking fans, it turns out that the ability of MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard to work with two memory types is fiction. DDR3 memory support hasn’t been implemented in a satisfactory way. Moreover, with DDR3 SDRAM the mainboard doesn’t allow setting its frequency to the maximum, and high frequencies are actually the only really exciting advance of DDR3 over DDR2. Besides, the mainboard loses some of its CPU overclocking potential.
It is sad news, but still let’s continue our experiments with DDR2 SDRAM, which doesn’t set any limitations. In Auto mode MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard set the “correct” timings recorded in the modules’ SPD, although the Performance Level again turned out different for two channels: 8 and 9 respectively.
To estimate the performance of an overclocked system we launched Everest Cache & Memory Benchmark and were shocked to see dramatically low read, write and copy speeds (first line). They were about three times as low as they were supposed to be for these settings!
However, we did expect results like that, although it was still frustrating. MSI P35 Platinum and MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboards have a pair of jumpers between the PCI Express slots that set the starting FSB frequency to 200, 266 or 333MHz. There is nothing bad about having these jumpers onboard. For example, DFI LANParty LT X38-T2R mainboard we have recently reviewed also allows changing the stating FSB frequency on the hardware level. However, it is an optional feature on DFI mainboard and we can still overclock the system using only BIOS settings. MSI, however, reminded us about FSB Strap phenomenon.
Here we have to remind you that the notion of FSB Strap was introduced to overclocking reality when Intel P965 Express based mainboards appeared in the market. It turned out that at some point the performance of an overclocked system came crashing down, and they called this phenomenon FSB Strap. For example, overclocked ASUS mainboards demonstrated pretty expected performance increase up to 400MHz FSB. However, once the frequency was set at least at 401MHz, the performance dropped down significantly, and could only be regained by further overclocking to 430-450MHz. All mainboards on newer Intel chipsets that came out afterwards were free from this drawbacks already, except MSI solutions.
To figure out what’s going on, you can take a look at our earlier MSI P35 Platinum Mainboard Review, namely the discussion of FSB Strap influence on the system performance. As we discovered, for CPU with 200MHz bus the performance drops when we switch from 381 to 382MHz FSB, and for CPUs with 266MHz bus the same performance drop occurs when we move from 447MHz to 448MHz FSB. It is an unpleasant effect, but there is nothing dramatic about it: just move the jumper from 200 to 266MHz, or from 266 to 333MHz to shift the FSB Strap threshold another 66MHz further. As a rule, this is enough to successfully overclock the system without losing any speed.
MSI P35 Platinum and MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboards are very similar that is why it is quite logical to assume they may have similar problems, too. We overclocked Intel Core 2 Duo E6300 processor with the default FSB frequency of 266MHz to 490MHz FSB, which is much higher than 448MHz where the performance should drop. No wonder that the results of Everest Cache & Memory Benchmark turned out so low. Let’s try and set the jumper to 333MHz and retest the system without changing anything else.
Compare these results with those on the previous screenshot to see that the performance numbers got back to normal. However, this doesn’t end our discussion. Switching the jumper doesn’t solve the problem, but just moves it aside. The difference between 200, 266 and 333MHz is 66.6MHz, this is the exact increment for FSB Strap threshold on MSI mainboards (447-381=66). So, we can assume that CPUs with 333MHz nominal FSB frequency and well-overclockable CPUs with 266MHz nominal FSB frequency will inevitably stumble upon unacceptable performance drop when moving from 513MHz to 514MHz (447+66-513). Intel Core 2 Duo E6300 processor cannot go past 490MHz FSB, however, we have seen before that Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 processor (3.0GHz, 333MHz FSB, 6MB, Wolfdale, rev.C0) can actually overclock at least to 530MHz FSB with the frequency multiplier reduced to x8.
We were going to use Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 processor to dot all i’s here, but unfortunately, we got the impression that MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard couldn’t work with Wolfdale CPUs at all. And what would you think if the mainboard set the multiplier to x6 instead of x9 and the processor Vcore to 1.115V instead of 1.225V on the very first boot-up? These values got back to normal after restart, but the system didn’t boot even a single time. The best we could see was a strange error message saying “The file is possibly corrupt. The file header checksum doesn’t match the computer checksum.” and then the board simply refused to work at all. However, MSI assured us that MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard did support Wolfdale processors, so we decided to continue experimenting.
I have to admit that the user’s manual for MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard describes a little bit lengthy but overall correct restart procedure after failed POST. You should try rebooting the system three times (with intervals of over 10 seconds between the attempts). The fourth time the mainboard will offer to press any key except Del and then will ask if you wish to save the BIOS settings (press Y for Yes) or load the pre-saved settings profile (press N for No). In fact the board sometimes responded after the first failed attempt already (which pleased us a lot), and sometimes reset all the parameters including the date and time to the nominal settings without even asking (which frustrated us a lot).
No wonder, since we know there are boards with impeccable WatchDog Timer technology, and boards that cannot monitor start POST at all, so you have to clear CMOS every time you over-overclock them. MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard seems to be somewhere in-between the two extremes, however, we have also discovered one more very unpleasant thing about it – it would occasionally freeze dead. First we experienced it when we replaced one type of memory with the other. Then it froze on us when we reset the jumpers setting the FSB speed, and once it happened even when we attempted to load the optimal BIOS defaults. When this happens, the mainboard doesn’t react to anything, Clear CMOS doesn’t help, the board powers on, but doesn’t start and the only thing that helps is to replace the CPU or the memory.
At first we supposed that MSI P35 Platinum Combo got into this catatonic stupor when we installed Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 processor, sow e decided to give it another try. To make sure that we do not provoke another stupor like that, we erased Intel Core 2 Duo E6300 overclocking data from the BIOS and loaded the optimized defaults. You can obviously imagine how surprised we were when the board refused to start Windows and produced the already familiar error message: “The file is possibly corrupt”! We rechecked all BIOS parameters, and they were normal, except for the DDR2 frequency that was set to 1066MHz being only 800MHz before. In fact there are a lot of mainboards that automatically set this frequency right away and work fine. Could it be the memory frequency? You will be surprised but MSI P35 Platinum Combo really cannot work with 1066MHz memory frequency! We couldn’t find a reasonable explanation for that, but the timings have nothing to do with it for sure, because we tried setting them manually to guaranteed correct values and it didn’t help.
So, we have almost accidentally revealed one more problem about MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard that may cost it performance: when the CPUs are running at the nominal speeds the memory frequency can never be set at 1066MHz. Now, however, we can explain why our initial attempts to boot with an Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 processor failed. The mainboard would set the memory frequency at 800MHz for Intel Core 2 Duo E6300 and Intel Core 2 Extreme QX6700 processors with the nominal 266MHz FSB frequency and they worked perfectly fine. However, for Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 with 333MHz FSB it would set the memory speed at 1066MHz, failed to boot and got into this “stupor” state after a few failed attempts. As we have already said, only replacing the CPU or the memory type helps get the board out of it, but what should you do if you simply don’t have an additional CPU or memory kit handy? The situation is not hopeless and you can revive the board by resetting the FSB frequency jumpers.
Unfortunately, we still couldn’t overclock our Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 processor. Even if the system loaded Windows, error messages or BSOD popped up during the first seconds of the Prime95 stability test. The CPU didn’t work at 470MHz FSB with its default multiplier, didn’t work at 530MHz FSB with the multiplier dropped to x8, although we made sure that these settings worked fine on other mainboards. Even reducing the frequency didn’t help regain stability.
1.55-1.6V that the Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 processor needs to speed up to 4.23GHz is quite high, however, we failed to get the system to run with Vcore at 1.5V and FSB frequency at 450MHz. And only at 1.4V Vcore and 420MHz FSB (420x9=3780MHz) the system worked for a few minutes instead of seconds. If we reduced the multiplier to x8, then 3780MHz frequency can be achieved with 472MHz FSB, which proved to be a good operational mode, too. So, why does the board work absolutely fine at 472MHz FSB but fails to run stably in the entire interval up to 420MHz? The resolution was very unexpected: we should disable EIST (Enhanced Intel SpeedStep Technology) in the BIOS in order to adjust processor frequency multiplier. Could it prevent MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard from overclocking Wolfdale CPUs?
And this assumption proved absolutely correct. 470x9 as well as 465x9 modes were very unstable, however we could get our system to work at 460MHz FSB (the mainboard always sets the FSB frequency 1MHz higher than what you have in the BIOS).
Of course, we are losing all power-saving modes if we disable EIST in the BIOS, the mainboard doesn’t reduce the clock frequency multiplier and voltage any more if there is no heavy workload. Besides, we failed to overclock the processor to its maximum like on other mainboards, but it was still way better than what we have initially achieved. High processor temperature prevented us from pushing its Vcore any further, as it rose to 76ºC during Prime95 tests. That is why we couldn’t at first start at 530MHz FSB with x8 multiplier, although we also disabled EIST – that was too good for MSI P35 Platinum Combo. The maximum we could overclock to with lowered x8 multiplier was 517MHz or 518MHz FSB (460x9=4140, 4140:8=517.5).
However, it was more than enough to finally see if the performance on MSI P35 Platinum and MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboards drops in the 513-515MHz FSB interval. We launched the system at 514MHz, tested the memory subsystem in Everest suite and obtained pretty realistic results:
And now let’s perform the same test at 515MHz, only 1MHz higher FSB frequency, with all the other settings and memory timings unchanged:
No comments are necessary. It doesn’t matter how far your processor can actually overclock. It doesn’t matter what the maximum bus frequency is when MSI P35 Platinum and MSI P35 Platinum Combo remain operational. The truth is that it doesn’t make sense to overclock past 514MHz, because the performance will drop down dramatically in this case.
As a rule, we do not pay that much attention to different mainboards technologies for automatic processor overclocking. Mostly because they usually limit the maximum overclocking by 20%-30%, while you can get much more flexibility in manual mode and can easily surpass these numbers. However, I made a serious mistake by not paying due attention to D.O.T. technology in MSI P35 Platinum mainboard review, which I admit today. So, let me make up for this frustrating omission on my part today, during our discussion of the MSI P35 Platinum Combo solution.
D.O.T. technology allows overclocking the CPU, graphics card or both by a certain value if the workload increases. When the workload reduces or disappears completely, everything returns to its initial state. When I saw 1%, 3% and 5% values I assumed that this was the best D.O.T. could do. In reality, these were simply the default values. The mainboard allows overclocking by up to 20%, which can be achieved in three steps, such as 7%, 14% and 20%, for instance.
The second mistake I made was a worse one. Until recently we had to choose between automatic and manual overclocking technologies, because they could only work if the CPU was initially at its default speeds. However take a look at the screenshot above: we are overclocking Intel Core 2 Extreme QX6700 and still can use dynamic overclocking technology!
Our practical experiments confirmed these functions first with Intel Core 2 Extreme QX6700 processor that could speed up to 3.4GHz. We reduced its clock frequency multiplier to x8, set the starting FSB frequency to 355MHz and then overclocked it by additional 20% using D.O.T. technology. As a result, the FSB frequency would increase from 355MHz to 424MHz every time the workload increased, and the CPU would run at its maximum speed of 3.4GHz!
However, this is not a typical example, we used an engineering samples of Core 2 Extreme QX6700 processor with an unlocked clock frequency multiplier. So, will the D.O.T. technology work with a mass production CPU? Yes, it will! For the next experiment we took Intel Core 2 Duo E6300 processor that could overclock to 490MHz FSB. We set its starting FSB frequency to 408MHz and followed with a three-stage additional overclocking by 7%, 14% and 20%. Power-saving technologies worked fine that is why the multiplier would drop to x6 in idle mode and the CPU would run at 2.45GHz. The first frequency increasing stage took place very quickly, we couldn’t detect it, but we could clearly see successful overclocking by 14% to 465MHz FSB. The clock multiplier in this case increased to x7 and the resulting processor frequency equaled 3.25GHz. The system would run like that for 2-3 seconds and then the FSB frequency would jump to the maximum of 489MHz.
MSI was the one to invent dynamic overclocking technology. This time they took it further and D.O.T. can be applied not only to the CPU running in its nominal mode, but also to an overclocked one. It is very interesting to see if other mainboard makers will be able to replicate the same approach. The only thing we would like to draw your attention to is the fact that with D.O.T. involved the system works a little unstably with the same frequency and voltage settings that would pass all stability tests flawlessly in case we overclocked without D.O.T.. I believe, however, that we can certainly find an optimal set of parameters when overclocking and D.O.T. will work well together and ensure more comfortable and quiet operation without workload and maximum possible overclocking results under heavy workload.
However, you will need to adjust processor fan rotation speed to reduce the noise and CPU temperature. In our tests this time we used a CPU cooler with a three-pin fan connector, so the fan rotation speed management function didn’t work. However, the mainboard’s manual states clearly that it should work for both: four- and three-pin fan connectors. Maybe we will be able to get it to work with MSI’s brand name programs and utilities? Let’s find out!
MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard comes bundled with two CD disks with drivers and utilities for Windows XP and Windows Vista. Each of them first of all offers to install the drivers:
The list of available software for Windows XP is quite impressive:
The Windows Vista package is a little bit more modest and includes only Live Update 3, Dual Core Center and Dual Core Center sidebar. Let’s install these applications.
Even from the name of the Live Update program you can understand that it searches online for the latest BIOS updates. It can search not only for the mainboard updates, but also for the graphics card and installed MSI utilities updates.
You can enable/disable automatic program launch on Windows start-up, MSI news, you can even change the interface colors, but there was no option to reflash the BIOS from the image file. This feature could be very useful for a testbed that is not connected to the Web yet, because MSI mainboard doesn’t have a built-in BIOS reflashing tool.
Dual CoreCenter utility may have got its name for the ability to control and manage not only and mainboard but also the graphics card operation. Only a small icon in the Windows system tray next to the clock indicates that this utility is working. If you roll the pointer over it, you will get a CPU temperature report. The program window is pretty compact:
By default it reports CPU temperature, FSB frequency and resulting CPU frequency. By clicking VGA button you can see graphics card temperature and frequency. There are five preset profiles: AV, Game, Office, Silence and Cool. “~” adjusts the system response to workload increase or reduction. BY pressing User Profile button, you will get a window where you can select one of the three available additional user profiles:
You can adjust parameters only in the user profiles, the default profile settings cannot be changed.
The buttons in the lower part of the main window will take you to the current temperature readings:
…to the fan rotation speed adjustment page:
…to the page where you can adjust processor Vcore, Vmem and chipset North Bridge voltage:
…to the page where you can overclock the CPU or graphics card:
D.O.T. button allows speeding the system up or slowing it down by up to 25%:
Overall, Dual CoreCenter program didn’t strike us as the most convenient to set up and use. There was no option to disable the program launch on Start-up, so we had to remove it because it failed to manage the rotation speed of a fan with a three-pin power connector.
You may know that there is a sidebar in Widows Vista where you can use a lot of Microsoft programs and third-party utilities. MSI Dual CoreCenter sidebar is one of them. The window looks very modest:
However, once you start working with it you will see all the features it has to offer, which you may never suspect at first glance. For example, if you roll the mouse pointer over the program window, you will get additional buttons:
M stands for Motherboard and the current CPU and mainboard parameters. V stands for VGA and reports the VGA settings.
The button on the very right opens a new window where you can select D.O.T. technology or one of the five preset profiles:
Setting button allows choosing one of the user defined profiles (A, B or C) and adjust it as desired or return to the default one.
In fact, you don’t even need to click on the D.O.T. tab or any others: all you need to do is just hold the pointer over the selected tab for a while.
The idea behind the Display tab was a little unclear at first.
Then we found out that it allowed choosing three parameters to be displayed in the main program window. There are three icons at the very bottom: CPU, FSB and Clock. And as you remember, by default we see CPU temperature, FSB frequency and resulting CPU speed. Drag and drop the Clock icon and replace it with Fan CPU and the main window will be reporting a little different thing now:
By the way, the graph stands for the first parameter in the list, which is CPU temperature in this case.
The last tab in the list allows converting ºC to ºF and disable the voice hints. Yes, the name of every menu item you roll your pointer over will be read to you with a pleasant though pretty mechanical female voice.
If you click Adjust instead of Settings, you will get access to even more features. First come the frequencies:
…then come the fan rotation speeds:
…then come the voltages:
…and at last the temperature management:
You may have noticed that there is a “VGA” word in almost every window in the right corner. By clicking it you can access the corresponding settings related to the graphics card.
I have to admit that the small and not very eye-catching at first MSI Dual Core Center sidebar utility is sometimes even superior in terms of features and functionality to the original MSI Dual CoreCenter. The only thing it lacks though is the interface adjustment option that would allow to change the window color, select the font, change the graph thickness.
Unfortunately, the developers will have to work a little more on MSI Dual Core Center sidebar utility, especially in terms of safety. When we started our system with an Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 processor in nominal mode the utility reduced its FSB frequency from 333MHz to 320MHz for some reason. And it was actually a pretty harmless joke. When we launched the system with the CPU overclocked by raising its Vcore, we discovered that it rose beyond 1.8V! Luckily, the CPU with the nominal Vcore of 1.225V didn’t burst out in flames, but we immediately removed the utility from our system. Besides, it also couldn’t enable fan rotation speed adjustment for our CPU fan with a three-pin power connector.
We all know very well that there are no mainboards without drawbacks. However, very rarely we come across solutions that are so easy to work with and boast so many features that we can simply disregard certain things. Unfortunately, we can’t say that MSI P35 Platinum Combo is one of them.
We much more frequently deal with mainboards that are very hard to characterize as good or bad. For every indisputable advantage there is always some frustrating drawback that is why a mainboard like that may be an excellent choice for one user, and absolutely unacceptable for another depending on their needs and circumstances. Does MSI P35 Platinum Combo mainboard belong to this group? Let’s list all the indisputable advantages we pointed out throughout this review:
I believe I didn’t miss anything important. And now let’s recall some of the drawbacks we discovered during our experience with this solution:
All in all, if we try to answer the question asked in the title of this article, we can say that you should rather use DDR2 SDRAM, because DDR3 support could have been better. And in this case, you might as well go for the regular MSI P35 Platinum mainboard, which costs even less than $150. Anyway, as we have already said, it may still be a great choice for your needs, it just depends what needs these are…