X-bit labs

Started by: Anemone | Date 04/21/05

Comments: 14 | Last Comment:  07/14/06

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1. No changes to Yonah? Despite several rumours of a stronger FP unit..? I'm doubtful that EM64T will be in Yonah, despite the fact that AMD will have dual core mobile 64 bit cpu's out long before Intel. But the lack of any improvements in the P-M's weak areas seems a bit strange.

Well, there will be certain tweaks in the Yonah, but keep in mind that minor tweaks also exist even in the Dothan over the Banias. Those are not substantial - no Vanderpool, La Grande, EM64T, etc.

http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/mobile/display/20050411010317.html

"Intel at IDF Spring 2005 in the USA disclosed three new technologies planned for Yonah that will improve the performance, power and design of mobile platforms. They include Intel Digital Media Boost, an instruction set for rich digital multimedia content creation; Intel Advanced Thermal Manager, for enhanced thermal monitoring, accuracy and responsiveness; and Intel Dynamic Power Coordination, which can automatically adjust the performance and power between the two processing cores on demand."

2. Suspect that Merom might be a super Yonah, expanding the thermal envelope and thus the clockspeed since that chip has such a good performance/clock.

Its rather funny to see Intel using words that sound at first like "65nm products will fit into current mobos" which is not, as we know, what is being said. But the wording tries to make you feel that way I think, and I doubt that is unintentional. Dual core Athlons really are looking quite good, with Intel competing on price rather than pure performance, at least on the desktop.

Yonah with no 64bit will be nice if it arrives early. If it arrives late or even on time early 06, it will be a flop IF Turion 64 bit becomes a strong market sell (does 64 bit show useful gains in a variety of apps) having no 64 bit on the mobile side could be a serious market issue. I think the "wish list" of Yonah has been trimmed because I would think Intel knows it would help them if they were to bring it earlier to market than planned.

$.02

Merom seems to be a different architecture, not an expanded Yonah.

I guess that the strenght of the Yonah will lie in well-established Centrino brand-name and broad support by many makers and form-factors. An additional strong point is that it is a dual-core product. AMD Turion 64 needs yet to win designs and that's not a kind of inevitable thing, as in the past it took AMD quite a while to make its products popular, especially in the mobile.

Intel seems to be on time with Yonah. In the latest financial statement it was indicated that "Capital spending for 2005 is now expected to be between $5.4 billion and $5.8 billion, higher than the previous expectation of between $4.9 billion and $5.3 billion, driven primarily by stronger than anticipated business and increased confidence in the company's 65nm process technology ramp."

3. Intel's 2006 desktop platform ROCKS!
know as AVERILL... is that the nickname or is the full name averill lavigne?.... rotfl

SO intel has A SOUL.... nicknaming their latest and greatest desktop platform after the alt-pop-rocker AVRIL LAVIGNE... (coincidence?... that the platform has a spelling that is the way her name is not pronouced?)

4. In thinking today I wonder, are they keeping the changes to Yonah simple so the single core version would be a plugin upgrade in the current 915 chipset?

If you kept things simple "enough" it might be a bios upgrade, plug in the new chip kind of thing.

I'm not super familiar with how that worked out on the move to Banias so if I'm wrong I'll take the "you're wrong!" humbly of course.

Intel has a new chipset to support Yonah. The Dothan worked with the same chipsets as Banias, if I understand correctly.

5. Anemone, you are pretty much way off when it comes to any of the future Pentium-M variants.

Yonah.
* Comes in beginning 2006
* 65nm process
* Six variants will come
(a) Regular voltaged dual-core Pentium-M
Codenames : X50, X40, X30, and X20.
(b) Low voltage dual-core Pentium-M
Codenames : X48 and X39
* 667MHz front side buses (likely)
* 2MB L2 Cache (shared between the 2 cores)
* Enhanced Speedstep
* Digital Media Boost (to Improve FP performance)
* Execute Disable Bit support
* Vanderpool Technology (or VT for short)
* Chipsets : i945GM, i945PM and i955XM Express
* Wireless "Golan" Pro Wireless 3945 a/b/g.


Merom will then come with EMT64 support.


As for the comment, "65nm products will fit into current mobos". I think you've completely missed the point.

Intel is tooting their 65nm process as being virtually troublefree for them. Its so good, that Intel has made fully working dual-core Yonah prototypes without trouble. (If you check the various IDF 2005 reports on hardware sites, you see the dual-core Yonah is very much alive and kicking.)

Intel is really talking about the thermal envelope. The 65nm process allows them to keep the thermal characteristics the same or lower, but with increased speed in future CPUs. So in the future, 3.8Ghz limitation will be surpassed. Its now obvious that they were perfecting the 65nm process before pushing on. And if you're curious, the 65nm process is in Oregon (USA), at Intel's D1D Fab.

Their engineers have worked very hard, and you won't see the disaster that was the 90nm Prescott. Which pretty much affect all CPU manufacturers...AMD and Apple relied on IBM's Fishkill facility in New York. The zero speed increases which with both AMD and PowerPC CPUs was because everyone was waiting for IBM to improve the 90nm SOI. IBM did that late last year, and the result is the recently reviewed "E-revision" A64 and Sempron CPUs. (And faster G5 CPUs for Apple).


The biggest thing EVERYONE has missed regarding dual-core...Have you noticed the pricing of Athlon64 X2 and Pentium-D?

Notice how the A64 X2 pricing starts where Pentium-D ends?

Do you know why A64 X2 are more expensive?

Its because they're for the "Enthusiasts" market! You know that market where AMD and Intel sell CPUs at ridiculous prices! (Extreme Edition and FX). That is it!

If you don't believe, look on AMD's official roadmap..."Toledo" (which is now Athlon64 X2) is in the same market segment as Athlon64 FX! You wonder why they're damn expensive!

Now, you compare that with Pentium-D...Slower and more affordable...Why?

Because these are marketed as "mainstream" desktop CPUs! This is part of the market that is below the "Enthusiasts" segment.

So now, look at this...Pentium-D vs Athlon64 X2.

This isn't a fair comparison. Why? Mainstream Desktop vs High-end Enthusiast product.

It isn't fair for AMD, because A64 X2 is NOT in the same price bracket as Pentium-D. And it isn't fair to Intel, because Pentium-D is a mainstream desktop CPU. Have a look at Anandtech's articles and overclockers.com on prices. You see AMD is going after the high-end consumer/enthusiast first, while Intel is going straight for the mainstream desktop user with a more affordable solution.

So far, I like the A64 X2 because it takes less of a performance hit in a multitasking scenario, it seems faster than having to spend $$$$ on a pair of Opteron 2xx CPUs, and it consumes 100W LESS power than the Pentium-D AND a dual CPU Opteron setup.

The problem is, it won't sell as fast as Pentium-Ds...Why? Because it ain't CHEAP! If you look at the general market, you see that budget gear sells far more than high-end stuff. Valve's recent survey of Half Life 2 gamers has shown the good old GF4MX/FX5200/Radeon9200 lines are mostly used.

BUt why has AMD done this? Because AMD does not have the capacity to produce alot of CPUs in a short period. They have to spread it out, until their manufacturing resources are capable of producing dual-core to meet demand. What they're doing is a repeat of how the A64 was introduced. They release CPUs with a high price, and gradually bring in cheaper ones as they produce more.

Intel, on the other hand, has the capacity to produce alot of CPUs in a short time. So they can meet the demand without too much issue. This is why they push dual-core in mainstream market first! Its cheaper, so more people would adopt it. That's how the real world works...Consumers mainly judge with their wallets.

Ok. or not....

AMD is more expensive because is a dual core setup while intel is two cores on the same package. AMD is more expensive to manufacture. Intel is using their excessive production and giving "almost" one core.
Intel mobo will be expensive I bet that, amd don’t!

Yes many people are using 5200, 9200, ... cards you know why? Because people don’t, I was talking with my friend last week and he said that had bought a super graphics, it was an fx5200!!! People don’t know what’s the difference between the cards, they look at the price and RAM, so between a 9250 256MB and a 9800 128MB even if they cost the same they go for the 9250. They don’t know what is AF or AA or how to enable it and since on the box both cards support them….

So big discovery you have made...

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