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Discussion on Article:
Intel’s Haswell Could Be Last Interchangeable Desktop Microprocessors - Report.
But to be honest, it is not that easy to guess early on which socket will be here to stay for a while, and which will be discarded in six months. Intel in particular has a pretty bad track record recently.
2011: LGA 1155 / 2011
Quote@exodeus "...all I have to give up is changeability? Shut up and take my money!"
then I'll call if for what it is... nonsense in the field of Intel stooge spin.
As you know, your multiple headed troll buddy j7 (formally jmlxg) who supports your biased view points has multiple accounts here and on other tech websites. I've seen some of the guys here carry on the battle with him on those sites.
But you're not too worried about his rigging of the system when it supports your Intel promoting activities here on Xbit, are you? Go hide under a bridge troll and don't come out.
It is impossible to ban you because you come back under multiple names here (possibly 10 others).
1) Managing the costs of failed components/RMA logistics. If your motherboard fails, your CPU is worthless. Right now if you buy a $325 i7-3770K and a $150 motherboard, if your motherboard fails, you can send it for repairs/RMA or just get a new one and you still have a working $325 chip. And if your chip fails, your motherboard is worthless. And in each case how does RMA and warranty get handled?
2) Chip-Motherboard inventory allocation to meet consumer demand becomes extremely difficult to manage. How do motherboard makers allocate chips with motherboards? Do high end chips go with high-end motherboards? If so how many i5 chips do you solder to $200 motherboards vs. i7 chips? Will there be an option to buy a $100 motherboard with a Core i7? Some people don't need features of a $200-300 motherboard but would rather spend that $ on an i7 because they might benefit from hyper-threading. This would be a nightmare to manage. This gets worse when you think of how many motherboard SKUs companies have.
3) Increased costs. Intel would have to ship its chips to each motherboard AIB and they would have to solder these chips onto their motherboards. That means additional transportation/handling and manufacturing costs that will be passed on to consumers.
Sounds like a BS rumor or misinterpreted. This could work for laptops but I can't see how this can work for desktops. I can definitely see Intel doing this for pre-built OEM systems and so on but not for the enthusiast PC market. We'll have some option of stand-alone CPUs on the desktop.
EDIT: This article is mistranslated.
This article says:
-- Intel will not provide new products for Desktop and non-BGA laptop segments in Broadwell era
-- Instead, they will provide higher clocked Haswell for those segments in 2014
-- Broadwell is "more than tick", and it will include some technologies that were previously planned for Skylake
-- This is because Intel needs to be more competitive in the tablet market, and this may mean the end of Tick-Tock strategy
-- It mentions nothing about Skylake and later or if they will be LGA or not for the desktop
I think Intel needs to prioritize power consumptions for smartphones/tablets and thin laptops but this is a separate market from high-end desktops that will still have Haswell chips up to at least 95W on Socket 1150.
jihadjoe, read this excellent article on what Haswell will bring:
I was actually about to jump onto SB-E, but after reading that article and knowing Haswell is just over a quarter away I've decided to stick to my Q6600 for just a little bit longer.
Soldier on, old boy!
I'm happy that you're happy, but when I invest 1000$ in a platform, I expect that to have a long life and diverse upgrade options.
How would you like if the maker of your 1000$ vacuum cleaner would suddenly change the connector on the dust bags and would simply tell you to buy another 1000$ device just one or two years later ?!?!
That ripping off the customers. Especially the premium customers that spend 1000$ just for the CPU and mainboard.
How about if I tell you that Intel DOES still make upgradeable 1366 Xeon processors today, but they purposely make them incompatible with older LGA 1366 mainboards ?!?!
I don't like it when a company screws me.
I agree with you about the potential problem. I don't think the idea of a soldiered CPU on motherboards can work well, unless the available range of CPU's becomes extremely small (one low end, one mid range, one high end, for example).
Therefore I assume that manufacturers will find a solution in the form of an add-in board for the CPU.
Intel has enormous capacity, and is actually not using it all, so why would they be afraid of making bigger chips? Why?
Going to BGA is a move to cater to the mainstream, and also to force enthusiasts to buy their higher-end chips that will allow upgrades.
Intel makes a lot of money in servers, and LGA 2011, et al, are just server processor derivatives. They aren't giving them up.
In fact, AMD has given up the high-end market, which is fine. They can't win it, so don't bother. Piledriver is a mediocre chip, which at least gives them some hope, unlike BD. NVIDIA is eating deeply into their market share as well.
AMD's best hope in 2013 is the Jaguar platform. Atom blows, and Jaguar will be powerful enough for the vast majority of people, and be low enough power to at least compete for a section of the tablet market. I expect it to be a very successful chip, based on what's been said about it.
And I do the upgrades after the prices come down a lot. People think that just because something new is out then you can't or shouldn't upgrade your existing platform. This is not true because it becomes very inexpensive to upgrade your processor after they have introduced something new. And When you make a big enough of a jump, then the performance gains a actually quite high. Both the upgrades I mentioned gave me much better performance and on the laptop it only cost me 40 dollars. I have also had to replace motherboards more times than I can count. You give a very poor argument for why it's OK to solder the CPU onto the main board.
Call them big screen office tablets, with touchscreens, with semi-mobile Socs and no battery.
Not even HP nowadays sells BGA-only laptops. It's a nightmare for inventories... unless Intel wants to produce only 3 or 4 models of chip.
What else do intel sell?
I hope we'll be able to replace the coolers with efficient/silent solutions.
Deals like the I5 750 or 2500k giving big rewards for a little work wont exist anymore. A sad day for overclockers!!!
Having a non-interchangeable processor method is OK for models like Apple's. Apple has figure what hardware their operating system should use for each area like low and high. Microsoft does not have such model. They provide the minimum requirements and let the end-user decide on the components. Really a non-interchangeable model for desktops just does not work especially for end-user that do DIY builds.
If a non-interchangeable processor method is used, the cost of time for me to take out the motherboard takes me about a hour. This means removing optical drive, power supply, and this is after I remove any expansion boards. Removing the motherboard out of a case is just a bitch and it is always the step that I dread doing for a computer. In business time is money. The non-interchangeable processor method will cost Dell and HP a lot of money to do processor upgrades or to replace processors that are dead. Few computer cases these days provides a way to pull out just the motherboard and these limited cases may have art design of the case not appealing to most people.
What is Intel thinking that desktops should go the non-interchangeable route when it hurts end-users, computer manufactures, and most of all the environment?
Intel has not released any statements about its commitment to the enthusiast community, who actually upgrades.
My guess is that Intel will offer 5-6 mainstream desktop CPU+mobo SKUs for SFF/AIO PCs (read: ITX). In addition, it will lower the entry-level of HEDT chips to $180 to keep enthusiasts happy.
You have completely misrepresented my views. Stop that.
I do not have multiple accounts. Present evidence now else cease this accusation.
I get up votes because people like what I write and conversely, you get down votes because of your nonsense and tone.
At this time on my screen you're sitting on 2 thumbs up and 3 thumbs down. Make that 4 now.
Almost every cpu build i have done in the past has been outdated in 6 months time. Now my 2600k is still a moST FORMIDABLE CPU Mine will easily break 5ghz but i stay at 4700mhz until i get a better cooler then my h60 type water cooler. Corsairs new h100i looks very awesome and is a improvement over there old h100. I will not use the stock fans unless they are quiet and i will have a push pull setup on the thing. But right now it is not needed so i will wait until the price drops since a 4700mhz 2600k is plenty fast that i wil not need to run at 5.3 ghz for a good while
I have to add my 2 i3 2120s are no joke they pack a great deal of performance into a cool running low power rig that is fantastic for my 2 HTPCs with HIS iCOOLER HD7750s that do not use a pci-e power connector and overclock from 800 core to well over 1100 and memory from 1125 to 1365 with no additional power but the pcie 16 slot bringing my stock score from 2665 to 3401 in 3dmark11 a dramatic 29% increase in performance. Also i have a 220 watt psu in one unit and a 300 watt in the other
A couple of years later AMD released phenom II x6 and I jumped from low to high end side (at the moment intel SB was not yet released) with just a bios Upgrade and the new cpu. Because at the moment I was able to afford the cpu alone.
Same I did with my girlfriend's pc this year, no much money to spend, so I got an i3 on a h61 mobo that can take up to ivy bridge chips, so once she is in better financial status to pay some more money she can upgrade to an i5.
Even if those platforms are obsolete after a couple of years, used cpus can save the day in cheap.
If intel start soldering their cpu's we gonna have way pricer computers, just as we see with the all in ones, 2-3 versions and pretty expensive.
I hope this scenario will never come true and keep both solutions in the market.
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